202. Insights and Strategies for Masters Runners

[00:00:00] This episode has been sponsored by a generation you can, more about our sponsor later on in the show.

[00:00:06] You're listening to Episode 202 of The Marathon Running Podcast.

[00:00:10] In this episode, we're going to talk about Running as a Master at Feet.

[00:00:22] This is The Marathon Running Podcast by Letty and Ryan from We Got the Runs.

[00:00:26] Join us in our Running Community for weekly content that is motivational, educational and inspirational

[00:00:32] and let The Marathon Running Podcast take you from the starting line to the finish line and beyond.

[00:00:42] Hey, runners and welcome to Episode 202. My name is Ledy.

[00:00:47] My name is Ryan and this dog's name is Lexi.

[00:00:50] For all of you guys that are watching on YouTube, welcome back if you're a long-term listener

[00:00:55] and hello, if you're new. We have a weekly marathon running podcast.

[00:00:59] We've had it for the past four years and we've grown just a little bit

[00:01:03] and it's been a lot of fun. We bring experts on when we can on training nutrition

[00:01:08] and we also bring you great stories from runners that have something to share.

[00:01:13] So if you're interested there is 201 episodes. Isn't that crazy?

[00:01:18] That's pretty crazy. It's a lot.

[00:01:20] Yes, and I'm sure some of them are going to be repetitive

[00:01:23] but there's always some new information out there. There's always a new viewpoint

[00:01:28] so I think it's still going to help long-term.

[00:01:30] Sometimes it is good to hear stuff double or repeatedly, right?

[00:01:35] Yeah, and things get updated and things change.

[00:01:38] I think you always try to find new people that have good ideas.

[00:01:43] Absolutely. Today we're unfortunately going to start this podcast

[00:01:48] out with some breaking news. The Boston marathon for 2024 has officially been canceled.

[00:01:57] We are just kind of learning that as we go, as we record this,

[00:02:01] we don't really know why that has happened yet.

[00:02:04] It's actually only happened one time and that was during COVID

[00:02:07] and besides that the Boston marathon has been around, you know,

[00:02:10] late 1800s and it never happens so.

[00:02:13] Number two, cancel day.

[00:02:15] Yeah.

[00:02:17] I wonder what the reason is going to be.

[00:02:19] I wonder if they will have a virtual option available again.

[00:02:23] In 2021, they had the virtual option and it was kind of cool.

[00:02:27] They sent you a package and you got your own bib

[00:02:30] and you can create your own finish line so maybe that's something we can look forward to here.

[00:02:34] Sorry for anyone that signed up. I guess you're out of luck.

[00:02:37] Hopefully you had a flight that is refundable

[00:02:40] and you don't lose too much money on your super expensive $1.

[00:02:45] All right, sorry. April fools!

[00:02:49] We let the cat out of the bag.

[00:02:51] No, we're going to wait till the end of the episode.

[00:02:53] I can't do that to our listeners.

[00:02:55] I'm sure like some of them fell off the treadmill

[00:02:58] and are now googling what's going on.

[00:03:00] You know what's going to believe us?

[00:03:02] No, I don't know. Let us know if you believed our prank.

[00:03:05] Let us know soon as a message on Instagram

[00:03:08] or YouTube, wherever you listen to this, let us know.

[00:03:11] It was actually Ryan's idea.

[00:03:13] To wait until the end of the episode to reveal your tail of life.

[00:03:19] I'd be more impactful that way.

[00:03:21] Well, anyway.

[00:03:23] You could keep a straight face.

[00:03:25] I couldn't keep a straight face, especially now that we're really recording these episodes too.

[00:03:29] And the Boston Marathon is something that everyone really is excited about

[00:03:33] and it's only two weeks away.

[00:03:35] And don't cancel your plans.

[00:03:37] Do not cancel your plans.

[00:03:39] So, how can we help them with their Boston Marathon today?

[00:03:44] Well, today is kind of unrelated.

[00:03:46] We just had a taper episode last week.

[00:03:48] So if you are in tapering, maybe go and listen to that episode from last week to 2001.

[00:03:55] 2001, episode 201.

[00:03:57] It is very insightful.

[00:03:59] And maybe you'll have some good tips that help you go through taper.

[00:04:03] But this episode is kind of more not necessarily entertaining, but definitely for you to learn as we age.

[00:04:11] Because guess what?

[00:04:12] Everyone's aging.

[00:04:13] Yes, everyone's aging.

[00:04:14] And so we were able to get a guest on her name is Rebecca Stevenson.

[00:04:19] And she's a master runner that had been running pretty competitively for 22 years prior to running her PR, a sub-three marathon at age 49.

[00:04:31] So you know she's definitely someone we can learn from.

[00:04:34] Yeah, and if you haven't qualified for the best of marathon, maybe you could age into it.

[00:04:38] You know what?

[00:04:39] With you saying aging into it, I tried that when I was 30 and then when I was an older 30, the times were just getting faster and faster.

[00:04:49] I think aging into it is getting extremely hard because of the influx of people that run.

[00:04:54] There are so many more runners than they're ever where before.

[00:04:56] Yeah, we talked about that before.

[00:04:58] It'll be interesting to see if that continues because you know, there will always be trends and there may have been.

[00:05:04] It may have been that running was less popular in the past, but at some point it'll probably reach like a.

[00:05:10] A balance point where more and more people go running and then it'll kind of level off.

[00:05:17] So maybe those times will stay similar.

[00:05:19] Oh, maybe not.

[00:05:20] Maybe the population will just keep increasing so much that.

[00:05:23] You know, they're always going to either have to make it bigger in which case if they can, it'll just keep getting harder.

[00:05:29] And I don't think we are really helping it with our amazing running podcast.

[00:05:33] I think if anything more enticing people to run more, right?

[00:05:35] And faster.

[00:05:37] Anyhow, so yes, so we speak with Rebecca and how about we start playing this and have her tell the story and inspire us.

[00:05:49] Sounds good.

[00:05:50] All right, so without any further ado, we're now going to play our conversation with Rebecca Stevenson.

[00:05:58] All right, so I'm on here with Rebecca Stevenson Rebecca.

[00:06:01] Thank you so much for joining me today.

[00:06:04] Oh, you're welcome.

[00:06:05] Very excited to be here.

[00:06:07] Yes. And so are we how about we start by talking a little bit about you.

[00:06:13] Tell us who you are and what you do for a living.

[00:06:17] Oh, okay.

[00:06:19] Yeah, I'm running and triathlon and fitness coach.

[00:06:25] And I've been coaching gosh for, I guess going on 22 years now.

[00:06:35] I'm also still a very competitive runner myself.

[00:06:41] I have been I started my journey as a competitive runner almost four decades ago.

[00:06:46] So you have been running since a very young age and we came into contact.

[00:06:52] You told me that you were actually able to PR in the marathon distance as a master, which happens a lot to runners that start running in their 40s

[00:07:00] because if you don't have a previous fast time then obviously it's easy to PR for you to see opposite because you've been running competitively for more than 20 years.

[00:07:09] So that triggered my interest in bringing on to talk about this whole master's running and how can we still give our best and you know when those age group rewards and all that stuff.

[00:07:21] And so maybe let's hear a little bit about your marathon running journey because tell us what you're in PRs and tell us how many marathon you've done before that and how it was working up to that PR.

[00:07:33] Okay, okay.

[00:07:36] So that was my that was only my tenth marathon.

[00:07:43] I had I had ran a couple of marathons three like in my youth basically in my low in my early 20s.

[00:07:54] The first marathon was actually running Boston as abandoned back when you could I was I went to Wellesley College and I would I would cheer for the runners every year right on the halfway.

[00:08:05] And one year I just decided I would I would hop in and and I ran that as my very first marathon and I remember how emotional I was finishing finishing then I didn't run a marathon until later in my in well, my 30s to early 40s.

[00:08:21] I was a couple of marathons as part of my triathlon training.

[00:08:25] And and then it sort of dawned on me one day that you know my goodness, I wish you know I'm getting up at this is when my late 40s I wish I had focused on the marathon when I got older I'm sorry when I was younger because now I'm getting older.

[00:08:41] I'm running out of time to try for this goal that was that was my my mother's goal and I even at a time thought well it just seemed so far from that.

[00:08:53] But let me see what I can do so with the pandemic and the dirt of triathlons I said are focusing on it and my times came down you know slowly slowly slowly.

[00:09:04] I run a few virtual marathons at the time and then I decided to give this up some three hour marathon a big shot I was you know super excited about it like I said under the pressure of I'm running out of time but was a positive pressure.

[00:09:23] And I'm saying that because we do slow down as we get older and the research shows that that starting in about in your 40s marathon times go down by about three minutes per per year.

[00:09:38] And so with this goal when I got very close to 301 I decided I don't want to end it at 301 which is where my mother had ended her career as a marathoner and so I did a couple of things I.

[00:09:51] I gave my goal a lot of importance which is something I encourage your your listeners to do and every goal if it challenges you the runner is is equally important and so I wrote that's you know break three hours on my treadmill I wrote it on the steering wheel of my car.

[00:10:11] And it was something that I was thinking about a lot during the weeks leading up to it and and I also used another powerful tool leddy which is I which is accountability I told like each of my friends all of my friends about it.

[00:10:28] And because it was a this was also virtual marathon. It was I don't know if you've heard of the world marathon majors global marathon that day off every year yeah and so some of my friends showed up on on marathon date some might several by surprise to to give me support at different points along the way some of them

[00:10:48] paste me for different around with me for different parts of it as they need to my three kids some gave me bike support and when I see footage now of me like in the basically starting about mile 15.

[00:11:01] I wasn't even running in my normal way my body was so broken down but I I gave the goal so much importance that I was going to do whatever it took to reach it and yeah and I guess the one thing I did differently

[00:11:17] training wise is I did more more runs of 22 and 23 miles so what I would call the super long run.

[00:11:30] Then I had up until that point in marathon training and really since I then I have since I gave I gave those priority and I also did several what I call fast finish runs where you run the last four or five miles at a faster pace to teach about it to like not slow down

[00:11:46] and your mind really because it's a big mental part is huge join those last miles of the marathon when your body is like crying for for mercy basically.

[00:11:56] Yeah well that's amazing congratulations on that I mean I'm sure you have a really strong mind that goes with that and won't let go of your goals but I do have a couple of questions just in regards to your approach.

[00:12:09] We've heard about the fast finish and how important it is to do these negative splits but when it comes to these longer runs there's a lot of mixed information out there.

[00:12:21] A lot of coaches tell their runners not to run these 22 23 mile runs because it means a lot of time on their feet what do you what do you tell your athletes because obviously for you to run 22 23 miles it doesn't go beyond two and a half hours

[00:12:38] but for a lot of runners that run slower paces than you that means you know three four hours on their feet which is said to be not that great to do what are your thoughts on that.

[00:12:51] Yeah that's a very good question my thoughts are I definitely think you want to do a couple of runs at least over that 20 mile bar because the 20 mile point is not that great.

[00:13:07] Point in the marathon and I think is a big they say that's where the marathon really starts right because that's when your body is getting really depleted of glycogen and your muscles are very broken down and even though it's only 10k left that's when you're most physically and mentally fatigue.

[00:13:24] So even though and I can I can bring up if it comes up low mileage I run low mileage and I have my athletes run low mileage we do a lot of cross training instead.

[00:13:35] It gives you a lot of confidence to do a couple of runs that are say 21 or 22 miles and that being said let me I don't mean like in the later weeks of the marathon to keep increasing your long run distance I mean even if you do like say two over the 20 mile

[00:13:53] and so you can even spread them out so you have like a week or so in between of like no even not no long run but a shorter long run or say 15 or 16 miles so so that is mentally and physically arrest from the longer run that's going to give you more confidence and more mobility and also not only more ability to push through fatigue but also more ability to practice your fueling in that later.

[00:14:19] So throughout the long run that's going to help you and race day.

[00:14:22] Okay, yeah that makes sense so perhaps you can share with us a little bit some insights on training needs that need to be adjusted for people that are masters so they can remain efficient and avoid injuries as we you know need more recovery time.

[00:14:39] Yes absolutely and you mentioned a key thing there which comes up a lot meeting more recovery time and the reason for that is as we age our bodies produce less growth hormone so we can still build up stronger but it just takes us more time to adapt to our training so that we do build up stronger towards those goals that we have.

[00:15:08] So you need you need more recovery between your key runs right your quality training sessions so that those runs are better quality and so that you don't get injured because injury happens when we're tired and our body hasn't had as has had enough time to build up stronger and to build up more resilient from the from the stress that running puts on our body.

[00:15:36] And so for example when I was younger I used to do like three quality runs a week and now I do two minutes when I have my master's runners do I do one that's like a speed workout kind of of session and it can be a tempo run.

[00:15:51] And for my marathoners then they'll do a long run which often will have quality in it but even by being a long run at a steady pace that is also quality and the other thing led is as we're older as we get older we need.

[00:16:10] We need to treat our bodies better like to prepare our bodies for example better for our runs by doing more mobility work for example instead of just going out the door for your run even if you have to shorten your run by five or ten minutes it really pays off to do say five or ten minutes of dynamic stretching that involves mobility work specially for your hips for your ankles.

[00:16:35] And we also just when it is one of the key sessions when we're trying to run fast we need more warm up time so when you're younger you if you're going to run it on the track you could hit the track and maybe run just a mile easy or even less but now extend that to like a mile and a half at least.

[00:16:54] And we need you need to be better also the things that matter after training to like stretching right afterwards eating within that half hour window if it's if it's again one of the quality sessions you know takes on a life of its own.

[00:17:15] Things that are very important considerations for yeah for masters runners.

[00:17:22] Yeah that's that's really interesting I just kind of want to mention in comment that you know meb when he had turned 40 he had had coach Larson be his running coach and when he was training for his Olympics he made his seven day run week into a nine day run week just to him self more recovery time.

[00:17:41] And then the anything that I think we all notice when we see video footage of people that a younger running it just seems like they're running normal but the older we get it feels like we do have that loss and mobility that it's almost like you you can tell that the run doesn't stretch out as far so that makes complete sense that you say that.

[00:18:00] Oh yeah yeah no I definitely have found myself a different I'll do a better quality run when I do the mobility work before I just feel stronger feel so much better than then if I don't do that you know they neglect that mobility work because we start losing like elasticity in our muscle tissues we get older and some might think oh I don't want to do less quality runs you know during my week or for example if you extend it to nine day week because I won't improve as much but.

[00:18:28] There's no point in you have to work with your body right what it can do for you there's no point in risking injury which will happen if you you know if you're not giving yourself that that recovery time by spreading out more those quality run sessions yeah that makes complete sense.

[00:18:46] Another question I have is in regards to the athletic journey for people that have not reached their ages 40 yet perhaps we can talk a little bit about what runners can expect around the time that they do turn 40 what are some things that change and how would they best be able to handle this transition.

[00:19:06] Okay yeah and it's an interesting question because of course it's not like you wake up on day and oh my goodness you know now I'm 40 now I'm not young anymore yeah I think one thing to encourage younger runners who might think oh my wow at least when I was growing up 40 was like over the hill is to think that you I think what's most important is to.

[00:19:36] It's to choose goals that you're super super excited about because they challenge you and so it doesn't have to be a PR I mean in my case I reached a PR when I was almost 50 but.

[00:19:50] It can be it can be something you've never done before like for example negative split a marathon or run a trail marathon.

[00:20:00] It can be something that you didn't think you could do anymore like run a marathon under a certain time even if it's not a PR and I also I also think to do things as you enter your 40s or as you think about becoming a master's runner is it becomes more important to really think deeply about your wise you know why not only come up with goals but why are these goals.

[00:20:30] It's important and there's a greater there are more potential wise as we get older because we've had disappointments from our younger years as runners.

[00:20:43] We have like more painful life circumstances we've gone through and I think what starts becoming bigger and more significant.

[00:20:52] More significant leddy is that we want to a big why that I experience and I've seen another master's runners is we want to inspire younger runners and see look you know you can still achieve really exciting goals as you get older.

[00:21:06] And even inspire our own kids or grandkids and the other thing is you're going to find that I'm a lot of masters runners are inspiring each other by by achieving this amazing things and what she's doing that or he is in you know his or her 50s or 60s I want to keep working towards you know something that I wonder if I can achieve.

[00:21:30] And I guess you know and I guess lastly convince yourself that you're you're not going to be able to train the same way as when you were younger because your body isn't the same.

[00:21:41] You know doing so would result in the frustration of of injury instead of the instead of enjoying your journey as a runner and improving towards your goals.

[00:21:53] So yeah younger runners you know I'm a mine your your listeners I mean look look forward to getting older because you you're still going to be just as excited about achieving whatever goals you.

[00:22:05] You set for yourself and begin even with surrounding yourself with with other master's runner sorry as a younger runner with with that master's runners because you're going to find that their joy in running.

[00:22:20] It is even bigger than for the most part than younger runners because we appreciate I know for myself like being able to run as a gift more than when we were younger especially because of all the times we've been sideline because of injuries.

[00:22:38] Yeah I agree as a new master runner myself it's been a really interesting journey.

[00:22:45] You kind of look forward to going up an age group but as running as it you know you have a lot of people that started running and now the field just seems to be just as competitive so while perhaps 10 years ago you looked at the masters and see these big gaps in what people are able to reach that is no longer the case right everybody has gotten so much better we have so much.

[00:23:06] Technology we have so much information when it comes to nutrition and shoes and and all that stuff I feel like you know by the time we reach 60 70 it's going to be probably just as competitive as as it is now but we have other things to look for to with that and I agree fully with you.

[00:23:23] I think one of them is being able to appreciate running so much more because of having had challenges such as injuries or children that keep you up at night and then finding that time to carve out more time for running has been pretty great.

[00:23:38] Yeah you know I should mention going back to choose something that you think maybe as a goal that you think you couldn't do anymore my parents I mentioned that my my dad brought the running movement to Brazil they are training for their first marathon in years my dad is an 86 year old and my mom is a 77 year old I mean they will take walking some walking breaks but most of their long runs that they're going on now or are just they're running like most most of the.

[00:24:08] They're just a few short walking breaks and so back to the inspiring I'm like you know they can do that at that age you know it's because they kept running.

[00:24:18] I don't know if I mentioned but my mom went back to running in the triathlon at 60 she she went on to become world champion in her age group in in the triathlon twice and in the do I fun once and so that was something she never imagined she would she would achieve this is like in her in her 60s.

[00:24:37] That's quite amazing you so you come from a you know really deep running family so it's great to see how that you know we always hope that our children at some point mirror our interests so with you they definitely had that happen.

[00:24:53] Yeah thanks.

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[00:26:36] So all right let's let me move on to another question in regards to strategies and mindsets I always say this to every person that comes onto the podcast where across this mindset path there is no training for mindset really I mean unless you work one on one with a psychiatrist sports psychiatrist

[00:26:58] for the average runners there is no booklet that says hey you've got eight weeks to train for this marathon here's what you do on day one two three four five et cetera.

[00:27:08] What are your advice and tips that you give to your athletes when it comes to how to train your mind and how to get it strong by the time the marathon rolls around.

[00:27:20] Yeah you know it is so much about what you what you tell yourself and I tell my athletes this all the time when you're out training especially the long run especially the quality sessions where you have to

[00:27:36] push your body and make those trying efforts you're training your body to you're sorry you're training your mind tell yourself the right positive things because what happens like you know ledi as a runner is when we start feeling tired

[00:27:51] that's those negative thoughts creep in and we you know and those negative thoughts usually have something to do with I can't do this so I have to slow down.

[00:28:02] So if you can turn that around first of all expect those thoughts to come don't be taken a back by them like oh my goodness there must be something wrong with my my with me because I'm thinking these negative thoughts and maybe my body just doesn't have it no expect there to be times when you're going to feel.

[00:28:21] Feel the fatigue and when you're with that going to start to think those negative thoughts important thing is to substitute them with positive thoughts that give you confidence and more motivation and drive and you do that both during your your quality session especially when you have to push like practicing telling yourself the right thing why is this important to you but also even in preparing for those quality sessions what why is it that I want to do a good session today it is because of my goal but what.

[00:28:51] Why is my goal important to me and then and then practicing all kinds of mental strategies that has worked I've worked and sometimes it's not thinking like those adrenaline thoughts with picturing the finish line or how hard you've already worked sometimes it's just repeating a mantra about how to run strongly i'm always telling my runners you know focus on something about the quickness and springiness in your push off so sometimes it's practicing this focusing on.

[00:29:21] On how you're pushing on how you're running that takes away from like paying attention to how the effort feels for example.

[00:29:30] Yeah that's good that's good and so do you tell them to do that every every morning or do you tell them to do that just sporadically whenever they feel it during your run.

[00:29:39] Yeah during the quality parts of run or during long runs you're practicing telling yourself the same kind of things that you're going to tell you don't even they will you won't naturally tell yourself those same kind of things during race day if you really trained your trained your brain in that way.

[00:30:01] Yeah that makes sense and from your experience what do you feel like when it comes to mindset has changed with those thoughts creeping in as you gained experience and as we age do you feel like you are.

[00:30:14] Being becoming a stronger person when it comes to that or do you feel like these thoughts become more aggressive as a master runner to quit and to you know just not not finish this run.

[00:30:29] Oh oh that those thoughts yeah.

[00:30:34] You know you've raised an incredibly important point because one of the things that we have to our advantage letting in and you're going to experience this your listeners as they as they age is one of the things that improves even though we do lose speed as we get older our mental toughness improves and I think part of that is practicing these mental strategies.

[00:30:58] So we gain a bigger repertoire of positive things we can we can tell ourselves and have more time we've had more experience practicing telling ourselves the right things that will that will drive us during training and therefore during races to but also and I feel like people might think this is only tangently related but also important is I think

[00:31:26] running is so therapeutic but we've we've gone through more like I mentioned like situations in life that are that are painful and it's a way to put you know it's sort of like a pain that you can control running it's a way to like put your emotions into running if you you know if you think about these you know these things that have been difficult for you and how they've affected you.

[00:31:50] And even negatively if you can put that emotion into the running this was something that helped you know has helped me do do really well that's also going to increase our mental toughness and ability to push through discomfort instead of letting the fatigue and discomfort and pain slow us down.

[00:32:09] Yeah yeah that makes sense. So earlier we touched a little bit on how master runners approach their runs a bit differently you mentioned that your master runners perhaps make their warm ups a little bit longer maybe run that warm up mile a little bit slower perhaps do some more dynamic stretching now let's talk a little bit about post run and recovery what do you recommend to master's runners that they do and put more

[00:32:39] emphasis on compared to the runner that's not a master runner yet.

[00:32:44] Okay post run well one thing is that the feeling in that half hour window ideally like right after a long run or quality run really does take on a life of its own it you're going to feel so much stronger your next run if you feel like right afterwards

[00:33:07] I have a friend for example who does that the shower smoothie so she arrives from fast run or long run and she knows she's going to go take a shower she's really like too tired to make her sound something sweet so she makes her self a smoothie and she literally takes it in the shower so with a lid on so that she can be like that I have to delay putting you know fuel into your muscles which is your muscle cells are going to be more open so you'll put more

[00:33:36] your this store more glycogen in your muscles for more repair and for more energy for next time so that's one thing the stretching right afterwards giving yourself the training yourself in a sense to massages when you can get them or if you're

[00:33:56] not affordable to you at least to foam rolling that really makes the difference to talk to get rid of that tightness for more mobility in your room for your running in general.

[00:34:09] Okay so I like that I like that nutrition and then maybe give yourself some more TLC yeah and more sleep ready to the fueling is how it's going to happen the building is stronger but.

[00:34:22] Be disciplined about the you know going to bed at a time that will give you enough sleep because that's that's where it happens that's where we build up when we build up stronger in our sleep.

[00:34:34] That's great advice yeah sleep is already so important so it's good to hear that that can also help us recover a little bit better now let's talk about the times when we're not running I know that we're being told strength training is more and more important there's science behind it that some certain

[00:34:50] strength exercises you know lunges and those things are proven to make us faster because of what muscle groups they work and how they work them now when it comes to master runners what are your recommendations for your athletes in regards to strength training.

[00:35:07] Yes very good question strength training creates a stronger more well balanced body that is more resilient to injury and so as master's runners

[00:35:18] let me what happens is we've developed different imbalances different compensation patterns patterns because of old injuries specially and so strength training is going to iron out those left right asymmetries for example and the other thing is all our muscle groups are not equally strong right with their you know tendons that go with it we have some weak links in our body

[00:35:47] and if you don't do strength training those weak muscles are going to try to keep up with the stronger ones when you run and eventually they're going to break down from the strain of that so strength training also helps to strengthen those weaker areas in our body with runners it's often the the lateral muscles

[00:36:07] and also we all need to improve our every one of our hip strength that is the strength in our glutes because those are going to stabilize us we'll be run and help to propel us forward and yeah the stronger you can get your hip muscles the more resilience injury you're going to be

[00:36:27] it's going to help you with your running you're going to be more resilient to injury because you don't overuse your hamstrings your quads your your hip flexors your calves but it's also going to make you a stronger better runner

[00:36:43] and yeah I do I do also recommend well I should take core strength is as many many benefits helping us maintain form when tired but I do also recommend a little bit not a lot but say one exercise in your strength training routine that is heavy lifting because that's going to improve the power in your push offs and it will help improve your running speed

[00:37:11] that is what we lose at a faster rate than endurance as older runners or as we aid and also plyometric drills have been shown to help us resist fatigue at the end of the marathon so different kinds of jumps or I do them myself and assign them to my athletes are really helpful

[00:37:33] yeah and the other thing is if you just run you're going to you're still going to lose muscle mass like people do even if they're not runners as they get older but if you strength train let it that's going to really go a long way to reducing or slowing down that loss of muscle mass that happens as we get older.

[00:37:55] Perfect thank you for explaining that i want to dive a little bit into the physiology of our bodies and what are the actual things that happened to us or you mentioned the loss of muscle elasticity and what other things can you tell us about and then why those things happen such as you know you.

[00:38:18] yeah so i mean definitely yeah lots of elasticity you know with with that some loss it in mobility you know like feeling more and more stiff especially after running the next morning feeling more stiff at the beginning of a run.

[00:38:35] we developed to some extent less or able to store a little less glycogen in our in our muscle cells and our liver than when we're.

[00:38:48] than when we're younger and so that's why that that feeling right afterwards you know feeling during the longer runs is important and you'll also find that.

[00:39:00] something that worked for you in terms of fueling during a long run might not work for like all the time because our body gets it becomes more difficult to absorb certain kinds of sugars so you of course don't want to take gels or drinks that are just going to sit in your stomach so you might also have to change that as you get older.

[00:39:24] and yeah and definitely you cannot you cannot run as many miles because of needing that that extra recovery time and so i'm a huge proponent of cross training.

[00:39:42] in fact you know if i can let you and your listeners into a little secret something that.

[00:39:52] I use as a powerful powerful secret weapon for my athletes and myself is that we're so used to when we're running just piling on the miles but doing across training training session.

[00:40:09] let me let the day after you you've just run is going to have bigger benefits for you in terms of increasing your total body strength and endurance.

[00:40:19] And also improving improving aerobic and your anaerobic conditioning then then doing another easy run or then doing an easy run you know for example if I instead of doing an easy run what I do and have my athletes is i'll do like a bite training session.

[00:40:38] Or or swim session in which how we include intervals so you're pushing during those intervals so you're making stronger efforts than you would going out for a slow run just to get the miles in.

[00:40:49] And so you're improving your your anaerobic conditioning as well you're improving your total body strength and you're not putting your body through that pounding of a running that might break it down somewhere turning into an injury.

[00:41:03] Okay, okay thank you that that makes a lot of sense yeah alright so we've talked about strength training so let's talk about a little bit of cross training for your master athletes do you recommend that they do more cross training or focus more on running and if you do give them cross training exercises what are they and what should they look like.

[00:41:26] Okay yes a good question well in my comments is surprised you that I run my marathon including my sub three running between 30 and 35 miles a week the rest of it comes from yes the 30 and 35 the rest of it of my fitness comes from supplementing that with cross training and in my case it's swimming by king.

[00:41:56] And strength training which like I mentioned is crucial and that's mostly what I assigned to my runners some of them prefer the optical or the stair master but basically you're going to get huge aerobic anaerobic and muscular strength endurance benefits as well as improve your mental game.

[00:42:21] If in other words increase your repertoire of mental strategies to push to discomfort and pain.

[00:42:28] By implementing cross training instead of more days of just easy miles and it will also it will increase your your love of running because if you're like just running day after day after day you're running a lot of that tired but if you can create if you include the variety of of say biking or swimming when you go and run two days out.

[00:42:51] After your previous you're going to be more excited about and more rested from running itself now with with biking the most effective way to do it is really on a on a space spin bike or trainer because then you can do intervals which are going to improve your anaerobic conditioning as well as aerobic.

[00:43:12] And when you do steady steady biking it's really important to maintain high cadence because for example when I'm biking I'm biking like at a hundred rotations per minute and so when I run it really has a good carry over effect to maintaining a high cadence running which ideally should be around 90.

[00:43:32] Swimming is a great way to increase your total body strength and upper body strength so that when you're tired your legs are tired running you're able to drive your arms more powerfully.

[00:43:44] And yeah and then strength training is an absolute must do so I definitely recommend instead of more miles to supplement with any if you haven't yet and you just you don't even know how good it will go about it choose one of these things and substitute it in for your easy.

[00:44:02] Runs because you can you can push and it's not going to you know it's not going to have a negative effect on it can still count as cross training but it will increase your aerobic and anaerobic conditioning more than going out for another easy run.

[00:44:17] Yeah yeah that makes sense i can't believe that you did your marathon PR on 35 miles plus cross training can I ask you what your first marathon time was just to compare and see what you started at when it comes to marathon.

[00:44:32] Oh when I went my very first marathon I didn't even break the four hour barrier it was a little bit over four was like 40.

[00:44:42] 405 406 yeah wow absolutely so it's yeah it's exciting to me to see that my times have got faster because one of the things I should mention let me let it to you and your listeners is one of the things that we find really rewarding is to study.

[00:45:02] That a graded performance charts i've heard of it but I haven't taken the time to look at it.

[00:45:09] Okay yeah maybe you'll get more interested as you get older but it is such a good happy feeling and big sense of achievement to say look at your 5 10k or marathon time like now whatever your age is you know say it's 54 but I'm not you but something they say I think 54 and then to compare it to their marathon time when they were 46 maybe the time it is.

[00:45:32] It's not as fast but it gives you a percentage and what your time you know it wouldn't be when you were younger and so you might very well find as you implement some of these strategies that I mentioned the mental ones and the training ones that your performance is actually better.

[00:45:49] The percentage is you know scores your performance then when you are younger so you know you you've run a better performance than you and you are younger and really that's what counts it's how we perform our age you know compared to what's.

[00:46:04] They do it relative to the world record of the age but relative to what is how we can expect to perform at that age yeah that's and then also obviously you know for people that ran a long time ago.

[00:46:17] And then have the super shoes that supposedly take off that 4% 5% all that stuff is a very interesting and I'm interested to look at that age created.

[00:46:28] Charm yeah yeah no because it's actually more fair way to and even compare you know performances from younger to older it's more about comparing our own performances but to compare.

[00:46:41] Performance is a more level ground yeah I shouldn't I shouldn't mention the one of things that slows us down also as we get older is our body becomes less efficient at transporting oxygen to our muscles so.

[00:46:54] Our view to max go you know goes down sort of at a steady slow pace but that is also that decline is also slow down by continuing to train and continuing to the quality sessions and are running yeah that's great thank you so much for explaining that.

[00:47:10] So Rebecca thank you so much please before we hop off let me know who your ideal athletes are and how they can get a hold of view if they wanted to coach with you.

[00:47:22] Okay sure you know I coach I coach actually athletes of every age but I more or more so I've been coaching older athletes and in other words athletes.

[00:47:35] At the approach and over 40 so in their masters years but I do coach younger athletes I even coach some high schoolers too individually and so if anybody has any any questions is interesting in my in my online coaching.

[00:47:55] If you're in Connecticut is interested in one on one sessions or any of my classes they can contact me at coach Rebecca 16 at gmail.com or they can just submit a form on my website which is conquering challenges dot com and that's also my my handle on Instagram conquering challenges.

[00:48:19] Perfect thank you Rebecca so much for your time we really appreciate you coming on.

[00:48:23] Oh you're welcome lady yeah it was a lot of fun yeah thank you for chatting with me today.

[00:48:32] Thank you Rebecca for speaking with us we really appreciate all the knowledge and your insight that was very exciting and for those of you listeners that now want to learn more from her I know she has her own sports community and everything but we will link her in the chat.

[00:48:49] I have a lot of information in the show notes so you can reach out to her if you're master runner or if you're going to be a master runner.

[00:48:56] Or you just want to know more.

[00:48:58] Exactly so I think that's it for today stay tuned for next week next week we are going to have an episode like every week and I actually don't know what we're going to be talking about.

[00:49:10] After that we'll have a running etiquette a topic that we've not really talked to and talked about in depth you know all these things such as which way to run on when you're running on a track and what lane can you run in.

[00:49:24] But the third week from next Tuesday will be a not interesting episode so don't listen to that one.

[00:49:29] Come on Ryan come with some slack here.

[00:49:33] Alright so that's it you guys tune in next week for a set episode that we don't know what is going to be yet.

[00:49:40] Hope you guys if you're tapering for Boston then good luck with that again do not cancel your reservations Boston has not been canceled and with that have a good week already.

[00:49:53] Thanks for tuning in for more information and marathon running news please head to www.marathonrunningpodcast.com

[00:50:06] And we'll be back next week.

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