252. How to get faster without killing yourself

[00:00:00] You're listening to episode 249 of the Marathon Running Podcast. In this episode, we're going to talk about how to run faster without killing yourself. This is the Marathon Running Podcast by Letty and Ryan from We Got The Runs. Join us in our running community for weekly content that is motivational, educational, and inspirational.

[00:00:26] And let the Marathon Running Podcast take you from the starting line to the finish line and beyond. Hey, runners, and welcome to episode 249. My name is Ryan. My name is Leigh. And we are the people of the Marathon Running Podcast and YouTube channel. If you guys haven't checked out our YouTube channel, it is at Running Podcast.

[00:00:51] And on there, we do shoe reviews, gear reviews, vlogs, all kinds of running content. And hopefully, we can get some of you listeners to maybe also do the visual. We do not post the podcast on there yet. Maybe in the future, but at this point, this is audio only. What's your latest video? Oh, my latest video is probably a shoe review at this point. We're pre-recording by a week, so that's what I'm thinking.

[00:01:18] I also recently made a video on explaining or demystifying the different foams. So you have TPU, EVA, PIVA, all those foams. So the recent video that we posted last week is what the foam meaning. What are these foams? That could be interesting. Yeah. It's a short, quick listen or view. So anyway, so you guys are here because you want to know how to get faster without killing yourself. And what do we mean by that, Ryan?

[00:01:47] How to optimize your training. Yes, exactly. If you are like me that loves running easy runs and longer runs, but never really pushes herself, the idea of trying to get faster sounds very daunting. And I recently subscribed to the app RUNNA for the London Marathon to see if I could get faster with it. And I'm following the training plan.

[00:02:13] And I think, you know, RUNNA is known to be pretty aggressive in the workout it gives you. So I do feel like at this point, I'm almost killing myself because I am basically sometimes even dry heaving after my workouts. And the idea is that maybe, well, for me, this is probably not balanced. I'm probably doing stuff that is too fast for me. And the idea is to kind of balance it, right? Balance is good. Yes. We'll see if it makes you faster.

[00:02:43] Exactly. So who are you talking to? Yeah. Yeah. So our expert for today is coach Erica Weitz. She has been running since age five. She's now in her 30s. So you do the math. She's also an elite runner and she's competed in the Olympic trials before. And so she's had a long journey of running, but also coaching runners. And she's really good. So it's kind of interesting to get her input on how to create that balance.

[00:03:10] What are the important runs to implement during your week and how to really make this a more pleasant experience? And then again, not kill yourself. And by not killing yourself, obviously, we also mean do not injure yourself, etc. Didn't we all run at age five? We all ran at age five, but we didn't compete in races like she did. Her dad was also an elite runner. So with that comes the whole, okay, now she's got a race. So she's done races when she was younger as well. Gotcha.

[00:03:41] So you want to get into it? Sure. So without further ado, we're now going to play our conversation with Erica Weitz. All right. I'm back on with Coach Erica. Erica, thank you so much for joining us again. Thanks so much, Leti. I always love being on your show and talking with you. Yes. And I love having you because of your experience. You're an Olympic trial runner and you have so much running and coaching experience. So with that, in your experience, I'm going to ask you, what is the biggest misconception

[00:04:11] that you feel runners have about getting faster? Oh, yeah. That's a very good question. There are a lot of misconceptions. And I would say the biggest one is like pushing yourself and running hard every day. A lot of people think that if they're not completely exhausted at the end of their run, that it wasn't a good run. And the thing is, you want to make sure that you're having those easy days in between your hard workouts. And as a beginner, maybe starting off, you may only do one hard workout a week.

[00:04:41] And then, you know, as you progress, maybe two, maybe three, usually around that. So the thing is, you got to make sure that you're recovering. You got to make sure that you're running easy on an easy run. So that way you can give it your all on your hard runs. I know I always talk about that. And it always drives me crazy with people that I see like running hard every day. And I'm like, just sit back. Don't say anything. But when it comes to my athletes, I'm very adamant about that.

[00:05:06] So yeah, I've had situations where I noticed that people's easy runs are too close to their pace, to their like speed workouts or the tempo runs. And I'm like, all right, something needs to be changed here. So yeah, there's lots of ways of slowing yourself down. And it can be very humbling at first. But then when you run fast on your fast runs, you're going to be so happy. And then your races will show it too. So I'm assuming with that, that you've had that before where you had a runner that was overtraining.

[00:05:36] So maybe you can share how that interaction was with that person and how it ended up helping him to not overtrain anymore. Yeah, yeah. Well, there's two different things like overtraining, but it could also be under recovering. So when it comes to my athletes, like I make sure that we set up a plan so that they're not overtraining. And if they, you know, sometimes we need to, I need to specify like how fast I want an athlete to run on their easy runs too.

[00:06:03] Um, and usually it's a conversation pace. Um, but then there's times where you can have a conversation even running quick, uh, if you're really conditioned. So you want to like slow yourself down and maybe even take a look at the heart rate. You don't want to get too obsessed with it, but, um, that's a good way to like kind of gauge where you're running, um, and how you, how you feel. And, um, if your Garmin tells you something, it may or may not be accurate depending on how new your Garmin is.

[00:06:30] Um, but you might want to try to invest in like one of those heart straps. Um, they go on your arm or on your, around your chest, and then that can sync with your Garmin and it can serve as a more accurate measurement of your heart rate. So that will help a lot. Um, and sorry, the question was, oh yes, I did have an athlete who was, um, I have had several athletes in the past who I noticed that like their paces were pretty close.

[00:06:57] Like their easy run pace was maybe only 30 seconds different from their tempo pace. And, um, so I had them run, I think it was the 80, 20 rule, that book, um, that talks about like 80% of your runs being easy and 20% of being fast. And then some people say that's not accurate, but, um, you know, it is, it is pretty accurate, but with, um, your speed workouts, like it may be a little more than 20% if you're, if

[00:07:23] I had this athlete take, read that book just as like extra reinforcement. So she was hearing it from me and she was also like reading a book. So it's like hearing from two different sources. It kind of sinks in more. Um, so she started taking it like much easier on her easy runs, like running maybe a minute and a half to two minutes slower than she was before. And then of course, sure enough, her tempo runs got like half, half a minute to about a minute faster overall. So that was a big difference. Um, and then her races started showing up way faster too.

[00:07:53] And like PR after PR, and that doesn't always happen, but in the beginning it can. And then sometimes we plateau a little bit. Um, that's normal. So, uh, it's really important to like take recovery weeks too. Um, another big myth I want to mention is, um, some people just keep building, building, building, um, and they never take recovery weeks. And that's like, so, so important. Um, so like your training is usually broken up into like phases and usually that's like three week blocks at a time.

[00:08:20] And then usually after that three week block, and it couldn't be two weeks, it could be three and a half depending on the athlete. But after that block, you usually have like a recovery week. Um, and I know for me, cause I have a coach too, even coaches need coaches. Um, my coach has me go really, I'm pretty, pretty intense buildup on that three week build. And then on the recovery week, it's very, very down. Um, so like I'm on my recovery week now I have extra energy. I'm feeling good.

[00:08:48] Um, and I feel like I need this recovery week because those three weeks were like, they were intense. And so like, I might have two or three days off on my recovery week, but then on those three week builds, I may not take any days off. Um, so usually with my athletes, I always have them take like a day off a week. Usually a lot of people don't like to do that, but I'll have them like cross train on that day off if they don't want to, if they want to do something and they're like, I can't take a day off. Like, yes, you can just do elliptical cycling, awkward jogging, anything but running.

[00:09:17] But then a lot of people enjoy that day off. Um, so the day off is important, but then the recovery weeks are really important too. Cause it gives your body like that full week to, you know, um, repair those muscles and all those, um, and just like kind of relax mentally and physically. Um, so that helps your overall training. So then when you get to that next three week block after the recovery week, you're ready to build up and you can run stronger than ever. I love it. And I love it that you are still training super hard too, because then your athletes

[00:09:46] can also look up to you and see you as a role model and see how easy you take your recovery weeks versus your build up weeks. So with that, it looks like a good balance plan has this intensity of recovery, consistency, and then obviously, you know, you're known for strength and flexibility. So maybe we can talk about consistency a little bit. What are your top tips for helping runners staying consistent even when they're busy? Oh yeah.

[00:10:13] So, um, I always say like from the beginning, um, start with your why. So know like why you want to run and like what your biggest goal is and always have that goal in mind, knowing that you have this goal there. You're going to wake up some days. You're going to be so excited. I can't wait to run and I'm going to go crush this workout so I can, you know, get closer to my goal. And then there's going to be days when you wake up and you're like, I just don't want to run today. I don't feel like it. I have so much other stuff to do. I'm tired. I want to sleep.

[00:10:41] But then you think about that goal and you're like, I'm just going to go do it, you know? And not every run is going to be like your best run ever. But if you go out there with that goal in mind, you're going to get it done. And then I always tell people like for me, anytime I don't want to do a workout and there's times when I don't feel like running too, which is crazy people think, but it's true. Um, I don't always want, I'm not always excited about it, but I think like, Hey, I got this goal. I I'm going to reach it. I want to reach it. The only way to do is if I get this done.

[00:11:10] Um, so then I get it in, uh, like an example is that I was, it was pouring rain the other night. And, uh, this was a couple of weeks back when it was like, we had a cold front in Florida, but it actually was cold. It was cold. It was raining. Um, the track that we have locally doesn't have, uh, lights on it. The track is not a rubber track either. It's like a hard paved track. Um, there were actually a couple of people out on the track, which was crazy. But most of my friends that I saw, they were like, Oh, I don't want to do the workout today.

[00:11:37] Like, or I thought I was going to run with a bunch of people and they were like, we're just running easy. We don't want to run in this weather. And I was like, I'm doing this workout no matter what. And maybe some of the paces were like a little bit slower, but I was running through puddles. Um, I was, it was pouring rain. It was cold. And I just took my jacket off cause it was soaked and just ran in my crop top and shorts cause I just had to do it. But, um, you know, it wasn't a fun experience. Like it was okay in the middle to end, but like in the beginning, you know, you're cold, you're rainy, wet.

[00:12:06] But, um, I was just thought of it while I was thinking was Boston. I'm going to get this best time at the Boston marathon. I'm going to have a breakthrough race and this is going to help me get there. And that's why you are an elite. And you know, it's so funny that you say that because my one question that I asked all the athletes, as you know, I was in Kenya for, for a run camp with the fastest marathoners in the world. The one question I asked each one of them was, what do you do when you don't want to do a workout?

[00:12:33] And every single one of them looked at me very bewilderedly and said, what do you mean? And I explained, well, what if you are tired? And they just said, this is the distance you're going to complete. So you're just going to do it. So I guess that's why, um, your mindset is already stronger. So thank you for reinforcing that. Oh, sorry. I was going to say it makes you stronger too. Like every time you push through that difficult scenario, um, like you're able to push through

[00:13:00] pain more efficiently and you're able to get through it and it doesn't feel as bad really. Yes. And then when you go to Boston and it is a tough time, then you remember all the hard things that you did for this, um, for this particular race. And then I'm sure that'll help you to power through it. Exactly. Yeah. And the faster you run, the faster you're done. I have that in mind. It has to help me though.

[00:13:27] So anyway, let's talk about, um, some more about the science behind easy running. What about these easy runs? Why do they help us so much? Oh yeah. So the easy runs help to build your cardiovascular endurance and, um, help to build your fitness fitness and it takes less stress off your body too. So you're able to get like that good cardio build without worrying about like tiring your legs out.

[00:13:55] Um, also that movement, that gentle movement will help you to recover from your previous workout. Um, help you to feel better. Uh, you can almost think of it as like, um, as like a recovery, one of your recovery tools, like, you know, an easy run can serve as a good recovery tool because you're like spinning out your legs. Um, instead of like, you know, if you're take off the day after a hard workout, sometimes your legs get really stiff if you're not like moving them as much. Um, so you want to make sure that you're, um, you know, you're spinning out those legs,

[00:14:23] you're, you're shaking out the cobwebs they say. And that way it helps you recover from the previous run and also helps you to adapt too. So, um, as long, you know, staying consistent with your running and, um, keeping up those easy runs in between your hard workouts. And that's going to help you to, um, become a better runner overall on your legs and your body and your mind and get used to it. And yeah, it's also a good way to clear your mind.

[00:14:48] And, you know, if you start thinking about some things or listen to music or podcasts or, um, audible or anything, you can always like just kind of zone out and get that easy run in. Perfect. Okay. So let's talk about the flip side of that. Let's talk about the hard stuff, the intervals. What are some common mistakes that runners make while they're doing their intervals and how can they avoid them? Yeah, definitely.

[00:15:14] I think the most common would be like going out too fast in the first interval, um, because we always feel good in the beginning. And a lot of people do that in races too. And then, you know, they end up burning out. I used to be one of those people in high school was a front runner. Like I'd get so excited and go out really quick in the first lap and then I might get passed. Um, and it took a really long time to like be able to like stay patient in the beginning. Um, cause because of the adrenaline of the race, your body's always going to feel really

[00:15:41] good in the beginning and you're not tired yet because you haven't run as much. Um, but then that pace doesn't feel so great after a while. So you got to really know where you're at when it comes to workouts. Um, so usually when I give athletes a workout in the beginning, um, I'll usually start them with, um, something like short, some short intervals, um, and kind of gauge how they do, but it's hard to set a pace when you don't really, um, when an athlete maybe doesn't have like a race time to go by. Um, or like maybe if they did, did run a race recently, I'll try to use that previous race

[00:16:11] kind of as a gauge, but give them a range of times to hit. So, um, I'll always instruct them to like go out on the easier end of that range, at least for the first one or two reps and see how they feel. Um, and then if that feels like pretty challenging, maybe stick to that easier end of the range, but if it feels like, oh, they could push themselves a little bit more than maybe towards that middle to end of the workout, um, maybe aim for that like middle to fast part of that range. Um, and then that helps them to not go out too quick.

[00:16:38] Um, another thing is like, um, there's certain runs, interval runs where you're going to walk in between, or maybe you're going to stand in between, but then there's others where you're going to jog in between. Um, it depends on what kind of workout you're doing, but most of the workouts that I have my athletes do, you're jogging in between, um, whether it's like 5k through marathon, um, unless it's like, let's say you're doing strides or maybe it's a Vito 2 max workout where you're really pushing and then we'll have like a full recovery in between.

[00:17:05] Um, but most of like the intervals or the tempo, like tempo broken tempos, you're going to jog in between because, um, the jog makes you stronger and the run makes you faster and you got to be fast and strong, um, to be a fast 5k through marathoner. So, um, so that's a really good, a good thing. Yeah. You got to make sure that making sure that you go out at a comfortable pace, um, comfortably quick, I would say, and then, you know, pick it up as you feel good.

[00:17:32] And you as an elite runners, how good are you at this point at doing those, for example, YASO 800, 10 times 800, how good are you at gauging the speed? So that way, I know that the goal is always to do the last ones finish, uh, faster than the beginning ones. Um, how good are you at gauging yourself at this point? And what are some tips for that? Oh yeah. Well, I would say like, I have a lot of experience with training and, um, but I'm not always

[00:18:01] at the same level of fitness as I, you know, sometimes it changes. Like if you come back from a break or, um, or maybe you're in your peak fitness and your best, um, I would say if that's a tough one, but I do like to keep my watch, um, beeping every half mile. So like, if I'm doing like longer intervals, I at least know where I'm at for that half mile if I need to pick it up or slow it down for the second half. Um, I noticed recently in myself that I have been going out a little too fast in the first rep.

[00:18:29] So if I have training partners that I'm running with, um, cause I, I'm like aggressive, I want to get after this workout. Um, but I want to make sure that I can sustain the pace throughout the workout. Um, so yeah, if I have training partners, like I'll say, Hey, you lead the first and second one because, um, that way I won't go out too fast. Like you can maybe try to slow us down. Um, and then I don't want to ruin the workout for other people too. So, um, yeah, just like kind of relaxing in the beginning is always helpful. And it's good.

[00:18:57] Cause the first rep shouldn't feel like insanely hard if you're going to have like 15 reps or something. Uh, and then, um, yeah, most of the runs that I do, um, most of the runs that I've been doing recently, like, um, the last, usually I'll keep a consistent pace throughout, but a lot of times I really do like to challenge myself and see like, maybe I can go faster on this last rep. Um, so the best way to do that is just like, you know, consciously telling yourself to relax throughout the rep.

[00:19:24] And, um, yeah, when you tell yourself things like your body will actually listen to that sometimes. So yeah, just, so try doing that. Like if you tell yourself to relax your shoulders or those little reminders you can give yourself, um, that will help you to run a successful workout and not go out too fast. Perfect. Erica, thank you so much. We've learned so much about consistency recovery and the importance of easy runs. If people want to reach you, how can they best find you? Yeah, definitely.

[00:19:52] They can find me through Instagram at, at Erica whites runs and that's E R I C A W E I T Z and runs R U N S. Um, but they can check out my website, uh, at exclusive endurance.com. And yes, you can send me an email at Erica at exclusive endurance.com and we'd love to hear from you. Perfect. And we will link everything in the show notes. Thank you so much. Thanks, Letty.

[00:20:21] Thank you so much, Erica, for coming on and speaking with us. As always, you've provided us with a ton of information tips that we can implement in our own running and you listeners, like I said, if you want to learn more about Erica or consider coaching with her, of course, we're going to link her in our show notes as well. Always good to catch up with Erica. Yes, it is. And she's running Boston this year. So hopefully we can see if she can once again qualify for the Olympic trials or if she'll do it later in the year.

[00:20:51] We'll see, we'll see how, uh, how she'll do. Sounds good. All right. So then, um, that concludes our episode of this week. Stay tuned for next week. Next week, we will hopefully have another interview with a run coach. And that's going to be all about imposter syndrome. Ryan, have you heard of imposter syndrome? Yes. You talk about it all the time. Oh, I mean, I do struggle with that my whole life, I guess. You say it a lot. I do.

[00:21:19] Oh, I feel like an imposter. I'm a lawyer. But then I feel like someone's going to find out I'm not a real lawyer, even though I am a lawyer. Like when I passed the bar, I passed it in California on the first try, which is great. But I felt like I had cheated the system. And I don't know why. I feel like I cheat the system all the time. Like even when I ran my fastest marathon, I felt like I was cheating the system. When I had my children and I went through childbirth, I felt like I cheated the system and I hadn't really birthed them.

[00:21:50] I don't know why I have such strong imposter syndrome feelings, but I guess I can Google that until next week and then I'll tell you guys about what we, why we figured out. Maybe there was something traumatizing that happened in my childhood. That's what I was thinking. Really? I don't know. I mean, maybe. Sense of inadequacy or something? What's inadequacy? Inadequacy. Oh. Oh. Oh. No, you made me feel like I'm not enough. All right.

[00:22:19] So I'm going to go cry myself to sleep. And with that. Have a good week of running. Thanks for tuning in. For more information and marathon running news, please head to www.marathonrunningpodcast.com and we'll be back next week.